What does secret pearl and plain edge mean

Discussion about Netherlands • 1 Gulden - Juliana

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I am trying to complete these all but dont really know what the plain edge on a lot of the coins means and what secret pearl mean 

Plain edge means there is no text on the edge but I have no idea about some obscure pearl etc..
What I would like to know what the ‘mistake’ is. That the line exists, that the coin exists? Right now this year line comment is worthless.

Mistake probably refers to that year only being made in Nickel KM#184a and not Silver.

 

https://en.numista.com/forum/topic99239.html

 

I call upon the Variant Wizard @Sjoelund to see if his has a secret pearl.

I have absolutely nothing on that, what about asking somebody from Holland having a catalog? @Salaction @smvdbrink @Dutchgalego 

 

It's probably connected (or not) to the hairnet? You normally find 5 pearls on it.

Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com

Thanks. I thought the hairnet also and went through those on Ucoin. I was hidden well as I didn't find it.

Are the plain edge coins rare? And is it reasonable for a beginning collecter like myself to complete these?

silvestervermolen

Are the plain edge coins rare? And is it reasonable for a beginning collecter like myself to complete these?

It doesn't matter if you are a new or an experienced collector, you can collect what you want😉 We all do that!

Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com

Difficult to search for a “secret pearl” if you don't know exactly where to search for and how it looks like.

Maybe this (right picture)?

 

By the way, during my search for the “secret pearl” I came across the Wikipedia page for the Dutch guilder:

Nice to see ALL references are Numista links.

If it's that why describe it “at top” ?

 

According tho this they are diamonds not pearls.  https://en.numista.com/forum/topic99898.html

rsirian1

If it's that why describe it “at top” ?

Oh sorry, I've messed up the pictures, now it's on top of the hairnet:

 

Hahaha, just kidding of course, but in the mean time I've found out what's it all about. But I can already tell you it has nothing to do with the hairnet.

I have to do a little bit more research.

Can't wait for that pearl of wisdom.  😊

My guess is at top of crown. 

I have unraveled the secret. There's a whole story behind it. I'm now taking pictures but I can already tell you the coin on the Numista coin page has a secret pearl too.

Very interesting , this is the first time in decades I have heard about this.

I'm looking forward to seeing that, which obviously means that more than ONE year can have the “secret” pearl!

Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com

You're right Ole. ALL the silver guilders have a secret pearl, but the 1954 also exists without that secret pearl.

The goal was to make it more difficult for counterfeiters. As long as they were not aware of that secret pearl you know if you have one without the secret pearl it's a fake (except for the 1954 since that date exists without that secret pearl too).

 

All pictures: © Schulman auction house

 

As you can see they started in 1954 with a secret pearl right on top. Every year, the secret pearl moves one pearl further, till the last silver coin in 1967. The nickel guilders don't have a secret pearl anymore. This also means, even when the date is for some reason (damage) no longer on the coin, you know from which date the coin is on the basis of the placement of the secret pearl, but don't forget, every year the coin was struck the secret pearl moves on one position further but some years the guilder wasn't struck. So to know the date on the basis of the placement of the secret pearl you also have to know which years the coin was struck.

 

Also  ALL the silver 2½ guilders have a secret pearl, every year one position further, the nickel 2½ guilders haven't a secret pearl:

© Schulman auction house

Great work, this was an interesting question from the OP and I was following it (unfortunately didn’t have time to research myself) but top work Essor Prof well appreciated, now I have to go and make sure all mine are real and not fake! Unfortunately don’t have a 54, so can’t be looking for one without.

„If your reply or post in the Forum stinks of AI, I will call you out! Knowledge comes from experience, the I in AI stands for incompetence.“

That's really something of the groovy. Bravo for your findings! You want me to try to document all that, or will you do it yourself?

👏👏👏👏👏👏

Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com

It's not the end of the story. The Royal Dutch Mint started with the secret pearls in 1910.

 

With the 1 Gulden 1910-1917 type (N#16127) the secret pearl starts on top of the cross but this times moves 2 pearls after each year:

All pictures: © Schulman auction house

 

The 1 Gulden 1922-1945 (N#6070) is a new type so the secret pearl starts again on top above the cross, moving again 2 positions after each year it was struck. The 1944P and 1945P weren't struck by the Royal Dutch Mint but by the Philadelphia Mint, so these dates don't have a secret pearl:

All pictures: © Schulman auction house

 

The 2½ Gulden 1929-1940 (N#6551) also has a secret pearl, but this time it moves every year 1 position but counterclockwise. Although between 1933 and the next date 1937 the secret pearl moved 2 positions (no idea why, maybe because there was a break between 1933 and 1937, although they never did this for other types where there was a break in striking):

All pictures: © Schulman auction house

 

Close-ups from the 2½ Gulden 1929-1940:

All pictures: © Schulman auction house

That's very interesting, bravo for finding it👍

Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com

Sjoelund

 

Bravo for your findings! You want me to try to document all that, or will you do it yourself?

I have no plans for this so go ahead. Hahaha, for the moment I have enough of guilders, I spent way too much time on it.

Essor Prof

Sjoelund

 

Bravo for your findings! You want me to try to document all that, or will you do it yourself?

I have no plans for this so go ahead. Hahaha, for the moment I have enough of guilders, I spent way too much time on it.

Your effort is greatly appreciated.

Wow, really great finds and interesting!

Only saw the post now.

 

Now I want to check my collection, but it’s back home and I’m not near it :(

Salaction

Here is my first try with the 1 gulden 1954 to 1967. Try to see, if it's like you would like to see it, I haven't the room for all the images, so I invented a “system”!

 

 

 

Comments are of course welcome

Ole

Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com

Wow Ole, I can't imagine how you can make this better. Your “system” is very resourceful, congratulations, well done.

Look good but change “where” to “when” and “moves” to “moved” in the yellow box.

 

Now's probably the time to have the 1968 year line removed.

Will do that when back in Paris.

Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com
Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com

The 1 gulden coins 1910-1917:

 

Comments are welcome.

Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com

The 1 gulden 1922-1945:

Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com

The 2 ½ gulden coin 1929-1940

Comments are welcome

Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com

Sjoelund

silvestervermolen

Are the plain edge coins rare? And is it reasonable for a beginning collecter like myself to complete these?

It doesn't matter if you are a new or an experienced collector, you can collect what you want😉 We all do that!

I ment like does anyone know where to find them or how rare they are?

I think the plain edge is a numista invention:

 

SCWC (no mention of any plain edges, they are all inscribed normally on a plain edge, and so are the coins in my collection):

UCoins are not mentioning any plain adges either:

NGC:

LastDodo:

I didn't find any references to coins with plain edge without inscription!

Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com

Sjoelund

The 2 ½ gulden coin 1929-1940

Comments are welcome

A very small remark: I would use counterclockwise instead of anticlockwise. They are both correct but counterclockwise is much more commonly used.

Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com

Well, well, well, we learn something new every day. It turns out there is even a second authenticity feature on the Netherlands 1 gulden 1954-1937, KM# 184. It's not as easy to see as the secret pearl but I checked with an 8 x magnifying glass and I could clearly see it.

The second authenticity feature: there is a notch on a letter on the edge lettering, for every date another letter. The notch is half way the letters on the left side (click to enlarge the picture):

I'll try to make some pictures of the coins themselves later.

Oh, the Dutch, never trusting anybody, not even the flying ones?

Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com

Here are all my Dutch km184 coins with the full edge inscriptions in mirror mode:

 

I still haven't tried to compare to the above definitions….. I'll let you enjoy some of the investigations as well?

 

Take care

Ole

Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com

Here are all my Dutch km184 coins with the full edge inscriptions in mirror mode:

 

I still haven't tried to compare to the above definitions….. I'll let you enjoy some of the investigations as well?

 

Take care

Ole

Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com

Here are the letters with their “notches”

 

and this is the full documentation:

Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com

Thank you very much Ole. I was very busy lately (my daughter is moving out her new house shortly and the whole house had to be emptied and painted) and didn't have the time yet to take pictures but now you did. It's more difficult to see than the secret pearls but you can indeed see all the notches are there.

I hope your daughter enjoyed you helping her. Once I stayed 6 weeks in the US helping my daughter to move from Washington DC to Oklahoma City….

 

The letters on the edges of the Dutch coins are not all the same size, and you also have pos A and B, so my images are looking like taken by a drunkard!!!!

 

Enjoy

Ole

Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com

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