Cob Help

Looking for a little help... this appears to be a 2 Reale Cob but I'm not sure from where?
6.60 Grams

https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces61427.html
The weight is almost the same, your coin coincides with this one of Colombia

引用する: "Zanzaretta007"​https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces61427.html
​The weight is almost the same, your coin coincides with this one of Colombia

​I was searching, Bolivia, Peru, Mexico, and Colombia but what concerns me about the OP coin is that the castles and lionss are reversed on the reverse. Personally, I have never seen that on a colonial cob anywhere. I could be wrong but it makes me wonder.

引用する: "harryg"​​​I was searching, Bolivia, Peru, Mexico, and Colombia but what concerns me about the OP coin is that the castles and shields are reversed.

​Sometime ago I did some research on Colombian cobs. If I'm not mistaken I saw it there. I'll try to find it back.

引用する: "Essor Prof"​

引用する: "harryg"​​​I was searching, Bolivia, Peru, Mexico, and Colombia but what concerns me about the OP coin is that the castles and shields are reversed.

​​Sometime ago I did some research on Colombian cobs. If I'm not mistaken I saw it there. I'll try to find it back.

​As have I, as well as owning colonial cobs. The example given is certainly not the coin the the OP has. I look forward to your example of reverse lions and castles as well as identifying the OP's coin.

引用する: "harryg"​​​I was searching, Bolivia, Peru, Mexico, and Colombia but what concerns me about the OP coin is that the castles and shields are reversed on the reverse.

Harry, ​I assume you've meant "the castles and lions"?

引用する: "harryg"​​​I was searching, Bolivia, Peru, Mexico, and Colombia but what concerns me about the OP coin is that the castles and shields are reversed on the reverse. Personally, I have never seen that on a colonial cob anywhere.

Can you be more specific about this quote? Do you specifically mean on a 2 Reales cob or on any cob? Or do you mean only on types with the Hapsburg shield on the obverse and the cross with the castles and lions on the reverse?
Because the 1/2 Real has also the reversed castles and lions on the reverse: https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces118047.html
As well as this Potosi 8 Reales coin: http://www.macuquina.com/intro-to_cobs/intro_to_cobs_23.htm
This Santa Fé 8 Reales even has the reversed castles and lions on both obverse and reverse: http://www.macuquina.com/intro-to_cobs/intro_to_cobs_28.htm
8 Reales Felipe IV 1621-1665, Colombia, the first and third picture have also the reversed castles and lions on both obverse and reverse: http://www.rhinocoins.com/spain/fil4o.html
And if you have plenty of time, maybe you can find something here. I had a quick look and didn't find anything, but maybe I've overlooked it since the structure of this website isn't build to find cobs easy: https://www.fuenterrebollo.com/faqs-numismatica/menu.html
The Eldorado collection of Colombian and Ecuadorian coins: https://media.stacksbowers.com/VirtualCatalogs/CatalogLibrary/SBG_Eldorado_Coins_Catalog.pdf:
Lot 11014, 8 Reales. Santa Fe de Nuevo Reino (Bogotá) mint. Philip IV (1621-1665). Restrepo M44.6., reversed castles and lions on both obverse and reverse
Lot 11016, 8 Reales. Santa Fe de Nuevo Reino (Bogotá) mint. Philip IV (1621-1665). Restrepo M44.12, idem.
Lot 11052, 4 Reales. Santa Fe de Nuevo Reino (Bogotá) mint. Philip IV (1621-1665). Restrepo M35.2, idem.
Lot 11053, (1627-33)-P 4 Reales. Santa Fe de Nuevo Reino (Bogotá) mint. Philip IV (1621-1665). Restrepo M35.3. Very intresting variety: the top panels in the shield on the obverse are swapped, the castle and lions are here on the top right corner in stead of the left top corner!
Lot 11068, 1627-P 2 Reales. Santa Fe de Nuevo Reino (Bogotá) mint. Philip IV (1621-1665). Restrepo M28.3. Finally a 2 Reales coin with the reversed castles and lions. This comes a lot closer to the OP's coin (although the cross on the reverse is misaligned on the OP's coin).
Lot 11081, 1627-P Real. Santa Fe de Nuevo Reino (Bogotá) mint. Philip IV (1621-1665). Restrepo M20., reversed castles and lions on both obverse and reverse.
Lot 11082, 1627-P Real. Santa Fe de Nuevo Reino (Bogotá) mint. Philip IV (1621-1665). Restrepo M20.3. Although the pictures are not very clear, I believe this is also one.
Lot 11083, 1627-P Real. Santa Fe de Nuevo Reino (Bogotá) mint. Philip IV (1621-1665). Restrepo M20.3. Idem.
Lot 11084, (1627)-P Real. Santa Fe de Nuevo Reino (Bogotá) mint. Philip IV (1621-1665). Restrepo M20.3. Idem.
Lot 11085, (1627)-P Real. Santa Fe de Nuevo Reino (Bogotá) mint. Philip IV (1621-1665). Restrepo M20.3. Idem.
Lot 11086, (1627)-P Real. Santa Fe de Nuevo Reino (Bogotá) mint. Philip IV (1621-1665). Restrepo M20.3. Idem.
Lot 11092, 1627-P Real. Santa Fe de Nuevo Reino (Bogotá) mint. Philip IV (1621-1665). Restrepo M20.12. Idem.
Lot 11095, (1627-50) Real. Santa Fe de Nuevo Reino (Bogotá) mint. Philip IV (1621-1665). Restrepo M20.32. Idem.
Lot 11116, 1660 1/2 Real. Santa Fe de Nuevo Reino (Bogotá) mint. Philip IV (1621-1665). Restrepo M16.6. Idem.
Lot 11126, 1726-FS 1/2 Real. Santa Fe de Nuevo Reino (Bogotá) mint. Philip V (1700-1746). Restrepo M68.2. Idem.

It looks like especially a lot of the 1627 coins have these reversed castles and lions but not all of them.

Yes. I did mean the castles and lions. I corrected that in my second post. Also yes to specifically the Hapsberg shield. I would imagine the assayer could get his head cut off for that.

Hi to all,

Strange cob, indeed, but not because of the fact that castles and lions are reversed (which is not uncommon in cobs), but it seems that the lions are "lying on their back", while castles stand upright.

If you turn the right picture 90° to the left, you will seen the lions standing upright and the castles lying on their side - but all of them in their correct shield-position!!

And if that was right, that would be really uncommon.

Please tell me wether I'm looking wrong or if you see the same thing ?!?!

Regards

引用する: "christianvl"​Hi to all,

​
​If you turn the right picture 90° to the left, you will seen the lions standing upright and the castles lying on their side - but all of them in their correct shield-position!!
​
​And if that was right, that would be really uncommon.
​
​Please tell me wether I'm looking wrong or if you see the same thing ?!?!
​
​Regards
​

​I saw the same thing. This coin just has too many mysteries for me .

Wow, It seem like I'm not the only one that is stumped over this coin! I must admit that I purposely omitted my observation about the reverse Castles & Loins being rotated just to see if anyone else picked up on it. Anyway, thank you for all your input but is it safe to say that this is Bogota mint?

Rotated Reverse Image...

At this point, I even question it's authenticity. I believe this would take an expert specializing in only Cob / Spanish Colonial coins. Here is a link where you may be able to send either a photo or the coin and perhaps they can figure it out. https://www.sedwickcoins.com/

Very good idea Harry. Daniel Frank Sedwick is co-author of the book "The Practical Book of Cobs", together with his father Frank Sedwick, who was an authority about cob coins: https://www.sedwickcoins.com/pboc4.htm
I wrote him a few times, asking permission to use the pictures of his auctions here on Numista but I never got an answer.

In case you don't get an answer either, here's the facebook page of Jorge Emilio Restrepo, an other authority about cobs, especially Colombian cobs, and author of the books "Macuquinas de Colombia (The Cobs of Colombia, South America)" and "The Cob Coinage of Colombia": https://www.facebook.com/jorgeemilio.restrepo. I don't have a facebook account so I can't see much, but maybe you can contact him. Or here you can see his email: http://docplayer.es/85672169-Numismaticas-correspondencia-jorge-emilio-restrepo-noviembre-tomo-vi-171-quinto-y-ultimo-cuadernillo-de-2015.html
Unfortunaly, I'm not even sure the man is still alive. If he is, he's now 89 years old. Till a few years ago he was still active on all kind of numismatic blogs but I'm afraid he passed away 3 years ago: I've found this video but unfortunately I don't speak Spanish. Anyways, here on the second page you can find an email address of probably his son/grandson: http://www.cyccoleccionistas.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/boletin-cyc-145.pdf

At last, in case nobody answers, here's the email address of Herman Blanton (author of this website: http://www.macuquina.com/index.html): hblanton@yahoo.com
Unfortunately, that website is written 20 years ago, so I have no idea if that address is still existing.

引用する: "Essor Prof"​Very good idea Harry. Daniel Frank Sedwick is .....
​I wrote him a few times, asking permission to use the pictures of his auctions here on Numista but I never got answer.......
​

​Requesting permission to use his photos and getting responses for coin identification are two different things. I have always found them to be very responsive with requests to help identify coins. Regardless, it costs nothing to ask. Sometimes they will simply ask for a photo and sometimes they will ask that the coin be sent to them. Very professional organization and the best I know pertaining to Spanish colonials. Convenient for me too as we are both located in Florida where lots of Spanish Colonial shipwrecks and treasure are found.